Thee Real Joy Podcast

Welcome back to Thee Real Joy Podcast.

Today I have with me...

Jamie.

The OG.

OG is back! Yeah.

I told you I was gonna see her
since I love her so bad.

Here she is. OG is back

OG is back in the building.

So to start this episode off, we are going
to read a journal prompt from.

Hopefully you got your journal.
What are you. What are you doing?

It's available. What are you waiting for?
What are you waiting for?

You wanna heal

No, Really?

Do you want to heal?

Do you want to heal?

So we have Thee Real
Joy podcast Journal,

which is a healing guided journal.

So we are going to do our prompt

So this says, what is the one

truth about myself
that I've been avoiding?

Oh yikes.

For sure. You go first.

Okay, I can say after doing my real talk,

I believe.

See, I don't even want to admit it.

I want to say it. I don’t
want to say it out loud.

I think.

The I am a true self-sabotager

Did i say that right?

self-sabotager

It's going to be a word today.

Yeah. It's got it's going to be a word.

That's a word.

It sure is

Its gon be a word today

it is like yes
I think that I truly self-sabotage

like I get in my mind
I, I don't even have to see it.

Outcome.

I create the outcome
in order to protect myself from

what it can actually be.

But how do you know? Right.

So I just completely avoid things,

or I just count myself out
before I can even get in the room.

Sometimes I don’t even show up
I just tell myself

You can't do that.

And that's a lie from the.

Pit of hell.

So yes that my truth

that I hate that
I have a void about admitting.

That I don't want to admit
but that you know, how

you just play things back
and you're like right

there, like, I see so many moments
where I've been like, right there.

And then you like.

I know, you know. Not gon do it

This ain't it. Yeah.

Yeah, but what if it was it.
But what if it was.

You done talk to yourself out of it

I talked myself out of it
and, you know, missed the thing.

So what about you?

What is one truth about yourself
that you've been avoiding?

Oh, man.

First of all,
I think there's several things.

That. I completely avoid.

But to narrow it down, the one

I think it is

like I have no control over people's
narratives.

Right.

And I have a hard time really

letting go from that, you know,
like if I'm in a difficult situation

or I had an argument or something
with somebody and it didn't end well.

I'm over here.

You over there.

I have a hard time fully letting go.

Because now they have their own version,

their own perspective,
their own narrative,

and they go and tell this person
and that person, that person.

And in fact,
I don't have any control over that.

Yeah, actually drives me insane.

Yeah. Like, what are you over there?
What are you saying?

Because people love to, like, spin things.

They love to spin things.
You think I'm a punk?

I ain’t no punk, I have issues with that.

I show you,
I gotta show you that I’m not no punk

I’m not no punk, Right.
And you tell me about you.

Tell me a lot, do you?

I let that go like you can't.

There's not for us.

You have no control. Somebody.

They're going to come up with,

whatever they want to come up with
is their narrative.

And I can't do anything about it.

And I know that. Right.

I really do know that.

But actually, I have a hard time.

Accepting. Accepting that know. It, but.

I know it.

That is hard.

I have not gotten to that point
of accepting it.

So yeah.

We do talk about

that a lot but that's real. Yes.

So today's episode is going to be on
a mother's love which I think is so like.

Oh. Just being a mom
I've only been a mom for ten years.

You've been a mom for 20 years. Yes.

It is such a a crazy ride for sure.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

I was about to say journey, but I think.

Crazy ride...

That's that's that's actually perfect.

It's such a crazy ride.

It's like a roller coaster ride.
Like. Yeah, absolutely.

From the age of, like, zero to like, two.

You're obsessed with your kid thing
are the cutest thing in the world. Yes.

They're like mama, woo!

Yeah, like you said. It. All right.

And then 2 to 4.

It's a little rough, little tough

Box out a toddler

Let me make you want to.

Like, oh for sure. Right.

When they headbutt
you in the head like that.

Yeah. Make your nose burn. Yeah,
absolutely.

I mean, I think from 4 to 7
you kind of get that.

Oh, they're going to school.

Yeah. Teeth are falling out.

Alot of first’s Yeah.

And then eight comes.

Oh yeah 8 to 9 I would say 8 to 10.

8 to 10. Yeah.

And my daughter's ten right now. Ooh baby.

8 to 10.

It's like okay so what I tell people
now 8 to 10 is like the pre-teen stages.

Yeah.

Today
if we think about how advanced kids are,

how things are so different,
8 to 10 is really.

Like it made them fast forward.

And yes, it's really like 11 or 13 now.

Right?

Because they're really not like
in this age

there's they're not allowed to be like kid
kids.

Like I feel like
they will still be playing

with like the little toy trucks
and the dolls and stuff at this age.

But, you know, there's
no toys at this age.

There's no toys. There's no toys. Yeah,
I agree with that.

I've had the conversations about her
having kids at school, and.

It has actually forced us
to have certain conversations with them.

But do you remember last year everything
that I was going through at school?

with Kalani Absolutely.

Y’all I was going to that school.

This little boy was telling Kalani,

How do I want to put this.

He was basically commenting

on her body parts
in ways that third graders.

Should not,
should. Not be commenting on their bodies.

And it was very awkward.

It was very weird.

But I had to start having conversations
with her about her body and her

knowing parts and putting words to things,
and it was just so to me, what felt like

we would be having those conversations
in like fifth and sixth grade.

Right?

Had to have it sooner.

Had to happen
sooner in third grade. Right.

So motherhood is just oh,

and I think it's like always this weight
because like I tell people all the time

when you're a mother, you realize, like,
I am raising someone

that's going to be an adult and who's
going to tell their side of things, right?

Because everybody has a side

I say you to be thinking that you're like,
doing everything that you need to do

for them, that you're showing up for them,
that you're doing it not perfect.

Right? Great.

Nobody can be perfect,

but you're

thinking that you're pouring into them
in these ways and their perspective.

It could be a whole different,
different thing.

Yeah.

Well, that's like what I, mentioned
in a previous episode

that we did with Madison. Yeah.

On mental health.

Remember
that therapy session I said we were in?

Yeah.

And she was just like,
honestly, it's my mom's fault.

Are you? Like, I was like.

WHO???

who your mama today?

You not talking to me?

I KNOW NOT

I'm like, nah, I've been here.

I mean, right.

And I tell you
that was like such a blow to me.

I couldn't even focus.
And then you can't even get angry, right?

I can't because. That's your kid.

Because that's your truth as her truth.

So it's finding your way through.

I want you to say your truth. Yeah.

I want to support you
through your truth. Right?

But right now, your truth is hurting me

Your truth is killing me.

I was like, what?

And I had to explain that to my daughter
because,

you know, there's been times or moments
I've wanted to do something with her.

I'll say some of the time she kind
of, like, shrug me off or just,

you know, give me a reaction
that may not be the warmest.

And I tell her all the time, I want you
to know that mommy is human too, right?

I have feelings,
I have emotions, and like, the same way

you want me to be warm and gentle
and loving with you.

I'm looking for that in return as well.

I feel like we have to, like,
take care of each other, right?

And I think a lot of times,
being moms, I think that we

it's often

hard for us to advocate for ourselves
in those moments because.

We’re mom. We’re moms,
it's like, deal with it.

Like always.

What I'm really trying
to raise my daughter to understand that.

Like, no, you have to.

The same way you want this respect,
the same way you want me to speak to you

the same way.

You have to do that in return, right?

Absolutely. Like so.

I think that that is just such a balance.

And being a mom, I think is about finding
that balance in general in life.

I know a lot of people who,

for me, yes, I am a mom first,

but I never want to lose
who I am to myself as well.

Like,
I. Don't wanna lose yourself in mother.

Yeah, like and I think that that is
so good because I've seen it done right.

I think I talked about it in the podcast,
maybe on the first episode.

I think that my mom, just

her whole life, was just focused
on being a mom, things and being a mom.

And when I got 18 years old,
and when I gotten to a certain place,

she was like,
I've been your mom my whole life.

Like, it's time for me to live now.

And I'm like, well,
you should have been living the same time.

Who? Who told you? Me who said that?

Because now it feels like this resentment.
Like where does that leave me?

Yeah, yeah, because I had the sacrifices
I had to do this.

I had to do this. Yeah.

So now you're an adult going to live,
and I'm going to live my life.

And I had a lot of people say that.

They're like, I can't wait to my kids are
this, I'm gonna start traveling.

I'm gonna start doing this.

I'm do that. Like, why do we feel like.

We are now? Yeah.

We have to put our life on hold
and, like, be this like,

strong, I think like, no.

Like, yeah.

I remember when I, got pregnant
with Madison, I was like, 23, 24.

And one of my friends, at the time,
she said, oh, man.

When I told her I was pregnant.

Dang that sucks. Your life is over.

I said, not over.

I said, Over???

Which and I actually I was so mad at her.

Yeah. She did not talk to her
for a very long time. Yeah.

Because I'm actually, like, still
going through all the emotions. Right?

I'm like, okay, I'm actually pregnant.

Like trying to figure that out. Right.

And then for you to tell me
that my life is over.

But absolutely not.

Absolutely not.
I have friends like that, too.

Like they'll be like, you know,

I don't know how y'all moms do it
because I'm not doing that.

I'm not putting my life on hold
to take care of somebody.

And they did it.

And I'm just sitting there like.

Right now.

Like I could,
I just could not do it like it.

Kudos to you because I want all my money,
I'm on all my time

and I'm like okay I get it.

But I also just feel like my life
is not like this 18 year sentence. No.

Well you. Have to put yourself
on the back burner.

Absolutely Not. and I just got to lock in
and like you can still find life.

Is balance. Is balance.

You still become who you want to be.

You can still do everything you want to
achieve, accomplish your goals.

Yeah, absolutely.
While being a mother, same time.

So I just think that that's true.

I think we're examples of that for sure.

Yeah, absolutely.

I definitely think that.

And I think that the kids,
when they come to the studio,

we often say at times they don't get it,
they don't understand.

Yeah.

But I can't wait until they get to an age
where they can appreciate it

and they can look back

and they can be like,
wow, like we watched our moms literally.

Yeah, like own their own business.

And like we saw it from the beginning to.

So we both got right.

But yes.

So how did you touch upon that?

Sorry to interrupt you.

Back when when when you just said

that you had to remind Kalani
that you have feelings, too.

And even though I'm your mom,

you know I still have feelings
because kids actually bully.

Oh, their parents. Especially girls.

Especially girls.

Yeah,
that dynamic is, like, so interesting.

I feel like. Yeah, it's. Like.

And I feel like we try to be so soft

And.

Loving and understanding and there's.

Just like, oh, yeah, we.

Boy. Right.

You're like, whoa, whoa.

I was being really soft

And then there's like.

Yeah, like I do not care.

Other day perfect example
I was, you know, doing my hair

and I was spraying this
like leave-in conditioner on my hair.

Kalani was sitting on the couch and I was like, you want mommy to spray your hair?

And she was like, um no. I was like,

I'm not gonna lie.

The pettiness in me.

I said, okay, well, if you want
crunchy hair, you can have crunchy hair.

She's like my hair is not crunchy

it is. but it is

Okay, because why are you trying to play me?

Right, right.

Just like. In that moment, I'm.

what did I do to you

You? Yeah, I'm sitting down.

Look, I don't even like wrestling.

We got wrestling on the TV
because that's what you want to watch.

I really want to be upstairs on my bed.
Right?

Trying to do this little
Mom daughter

Why you got an attitude, right.

I have two, I have two

I was the six year old bullies
me and 20 year old bullies me.

They’re so soft

As soon as you fix your lips, even saying,
oh, why are you talking to me?

Like,
talk to me like the tears, the sad face.

I should just go in her room
and I'm like, walk away.

Why can't you right now?

That's that's a real thing
kids actually bully their parents

They do. Absolutely.

We want him to talk about these bullies.

Yeah. Okay.

I don’t care what anybody says

It is. When you talk about motherhood,

I often think of times a lot.

So like,
I know this is like a reoccurring.

I lost my mom at an early age.

So when I talk about mothering,
a lot of times I try to do it

from the lens that she mothered me
right with, you know, through.

And how do you feel about that?

Do you feel like
that's like a positive thing, like

how do you feel like
when it comes to mothering, do you do it

the way that your mama, that you were,
have you found like your own spin to it?

Yeah, I do find that I do a lot of what

my mom did with us,
probably most things that I know.

Right.

Even the things I did not like. Right.

And I actually have made sense of
or find the value in, I definitely parent

the way my mom, even the way, you know,
she woke me up in the morning

when we my brother,
she had this little song.

Good morning. Good morning.

You know, I mean, I sing this song,
but I'm very soft with my kids,

waking them up in the morning like,
very gentle, low voice.

I'm all about experiences and the time

I try to be intentional,
with my time in the house, with them.

And because that's what my mom did. Yeah.

And I think we have to be aware

too of the way our parents
parenting us through their trauma.

So I feel

like, yes, there's some great things
that I have taken from my mom,

some valuable lessons and really,
you know, good things.

And there's not
there's some not so good things.

Yeah.

Because it was coming through her trauma.

She parented us
through some of her trauma. Yeah.

So I think we have to be really aware
because I think that's how we break

generational curses. Yeah.

You know,
and there are lots of generational curses

that my mother intentionally broke, right.

Because she was

we were just talking about that
the other day.

Yeah, right. Stuff that her mom did.

You know, she she did what?

You know what?

She, you know, the best she could
with what she had. Right?

But it was through her
trauma pass on to my mom.

My mom was very. And she spoke about that
when we were a kid.

My mom was very open. Yeah,
she spoke about that.

Now I'm breaking this.

She's. I'm breaking this curse.

She's.

I am on my knees every day breaking it
so that you and your brother,

I think you're not going to do A, B and C.

Yeah. Right. And I look back to

just my mom.

Growing up, I always knew that
my mom was a daddy's girl.

Like her and her dad.

And it's funny because then I became like
that or my grandfather like that was my

but I did not see her have this

nurturing,
loving relationship with her mom.

I feel like a lot of things she did for
her mom was out of obligation.

But when she did for my grandfather,
it was came from a place of love.

Or it came from a place of like
she felt moved to do it.

And it's so crazy now.

Because how how she was loved
by both of them.

I think.

So I think that my mom embodied

a lot of my grandfather's values
and just who he was as a person.

He was very strong, like how I described
my mom and how I described me.

I can see that coming from my grandfather.

He was a man of little words.

He did not say much,
but you can feel his presence when he

walked in the room, right?

And yeah, so her

My grandma.

I didn't see from my perspective of them
having this like,

oh, my daughter, oh, my mom.

I can see that relationship
with my grandmother

and her other daughter,
but not necessarily with my mom.

And I think my mom was trying to heal
that through being a mom to me.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Because my mom was the opposite.

So nurturing spoke life.

into me, you know, like
so I often wonder if she was trying to

mother me while healing that with her.

And you know, my.

Absolutely I can relate to some of that.

Yeah.

And watching my mom's relationship

with her mom,
my mom adored my grandmother.

Yeah. Like, adored her.

And my grandmother was a great mom.

She was a great grandmother.

But I have to say, my grandmother
was a little weird with my mom.

Yeah, it was.

It was a little strange. Weird, right?

A little strange, like, for instance,
remembering everybody's birthdays.

In a way, we get, you know,
she did this lemon frosted cake.

But when my mom's birthday came around,
which was the week of Thanksgiving.

Don't change. You forget that.

How do you forget that?

This is.
My mom wouldn't get the phone calls.

And this was as an adult,
so I don't even know, like childhood.

How would that look like? Exactly?

But as an adult,

she would, like, forget my mom's birthday
or my mom wouldn't get the cake.

Which is crazy.

You say that too, because I remember
my mom always talking about how she didn't

get a birthday party because they
they was right before school started.

So it was like almost in her head,
like she made an excuse.

Yeah, of why
she didn't get a birthday party. Right.

So that's just so weird.

But what they did with that as mothers,
I think, like you said,

my mom was very intentional.

Yes. And, like, had these conversations
with me at an early age, like no

we're doing this because of A, B and C,
I know in this house we say, I love you.

Yes. When we go to sleep, I'm not.
Going to be angry.

Yeah. You apologize. Yeah. Yeah.

So I wonder if being a mom to us
healed the wounds with their mom.

I think part of it.

Well for my, for my experience
I think part of it.

But when my grandmother was transitioning
right in

and my mom became her caretaker.

Yeah.

I can also see my mom still searching
for answers in that, in the way

she cared for my mother, my grandmother,
like she were over and beyond, I think.

Still trying to look for that. Like.

Like I said, I remember
my mom adored my grandmother.

Yeah.

And I saw in her caretaking too,
like, went over and beyond,

but I saw it through a lens of,
like, still searching for that,

acceptance or.

Appreciation and.

Appreciation or whatever trauma happened

at whatever age, that showing up
a little bit too, and still wanting

my grandmother to see something,
even through her transitioning.

Yeah, that my mom wasn't hearing.

Wow. That's powerful. Right.

And it's just like.

And so watching this was very interesting
from my perspective.

And then hearing
my mom talk to me about her,

you know, journey with taking care
of my grandmother and whatnot

and how she felt
versus her siblings in the way.

Yeah, all of that.

It was just like, that's cool. Yeah, yeah.

Because I often think at times me as a mom
and how I go about things

and you probably hear me
say this all the time, I compare myself

to me being my mom and Kalani being me.

Because it doesn't help
that the little girl looks.

Just like, just. Like me.

When I was her age.

And then I just feel like
because I've embodied my mom's spirit

and everything about her,
I'm just like, oh, like, it's such a

it's such an interesting dynamic,

I would say, because I feel like I have

I have used that energy of grief
and everything with my mom

to kind of recreate
what I have with my mom, with my daughter.

But then I often wonder in times,
am I putting too much weight

on my daughter in that relationship to
like, be this thing that helps, you know?

And I mean, I just feel like in times
when we're doing things,

we feel like it's like a positive.

But like at the end, right when she gets
we come to the adult, right?

She's going to have her perspective.

And I wonder what that's
going to look like. Yeah.

So do you feel like, there are parts

from the way your mom, parents, you
that you were trying to heal

and do?

Does that show up in your parenting? Yes.

Oh my gosh.

And the biggest thing

we've talked about this, I remember
like, broke down in tears at your house,

you know, if you remember this,
but my mom, being a single mom,

she often needed breaks
and she needed time.

So I remember, like,
being at family members house who, like,

they were trying to hide the fact
that they wasn't trying to babysit.

Right?

So I remember, like, always being around,
being the only kid

So like whether it was my grandma
watching me,

my aunt watching, somebody's watching me.

I felt unwanted there
and I felt like they didn't want me.

So I would try to like make myself
so small and not speak, I would

tip toe to the bathroom

Room. Yeah. I would like be invisible.

Almost like I wasn't a bother,
I wasn't a nuisance.

Right.

And I remember going back to my Aunt Kris

for that episode, but she was letting me
stay at her house one day.

I, like, came here.

She was like, I can never tell
when you're, like, in my house.

Like, I can't tell when you're here.

Like,
who's to say the same thing you like?

It's like I would just sit in one spot.

I didn't want to be in the way.

I was like, tuck myself away.

And she was like,

even when she went in the room after that,
she was like, everything was put back.

Like I was never there. Yes.

She's like, I can't even tell. Like,
are you staying here?

Like I said, you can stay here.

Like I'm like, yeah, these, like,

you put everything back as if, like,
you weren't even never here.

And I think that comes from,

being a child and just knowing, like I,
we hear my grandma on the floor.

Yeah.

She brought this girl over here again,

and I got to take care of her and blah,
blah, blah.

So I was like, okay, like,
I don't want to say anything

Let me be almost invisible.

Yeah. It was like that. Yeah.

It was like that at my house, too,
when you came to stay with us.

All of a sudden you just tiptoe off.

And I remember,
you know, we had Christmas or whatever,

and people would be like, Where Eb?
yeah, that was like she disappeared.

Eb went upstairs

She's fine.

She's fine.

And. And I was like,
yeah, she'll reappear.

She may not. But all of a sudden.

And you tiptoe upstairs

So I think I have this guilt
when it comes to Kalani being somewhere.

My daughter knows
she can go and stay or somebody's house.

She can text me at 2:00 in the morning
and say, hey, mom, can you pick me up?

And I'm like, I'm asleep.

Like, mom,
because I don't want her to be somewhere

and embody that feeling of like,
not wanting to be there.

I don't know how to explain it

because it's not the same,
because sometimes she chooses to be there.

But I think I do parent from that trauma,
you know?

Yeah.
So that's like one of the examples I can.

Think right, right.

How do you do,
you know, how do you break that trauma?

How do you I know you
I know you're not there yet, but,

you know, I guess rhetorical question.

Or you can answer if you're trying to.

Yeah,
I think that often in times I have to.

When see kids kind of like what we said.

Back to the bullying thing.
Kids are smart,

they're very smart.

And even though they don't know
exactly what they're doing,

they they run on patterns, right?

Yeah. Yeah.

So I feel like once my daughter realizes
that she uses it to her.

Yeah, I know my mom going to come give me
I know.

My mom's going to come get me.

And I almost become like this control
thing.

I for. Sure, I definitely.

And sometimes I have to like or like this
power dynamic struggle, I feel like.

So I really am
trying to be better about that.

Like if she goes to someone's house,

I have a sit down talk with her
like, listen, you're making this decision.

Like, think of all that goes with that.

Like, you know, when you and
I will make her commit to that decision.

Like, if you're going to stay over here,
like that's going to be.

And I'll see you in the morning. Right?

And at last, an emergency,
you know what I mean?

But they can't just be oh,
I changed my mind. Right.

So just talking to her about commitments,
I feel like that's huge.

And I'm trying
to, like, work through that. With that.

So. Yeah, I see it. I definitely see it.

Yeah.

And I think sometimes I struggle too,
with my boundaries,

with that because so often
I like, for instance, Super Bowl.

Yeah. I knew you needed a break.

Yeah.

Kalani was sick like sick. Sick, right.

But she had gotten to the point,
you know, medicines.

And she was she was doing better.
She wasn't 100%, but she was doing better.

But I know you needed a break,
right? Yeah.

And so I was like, oh,
I'm going to the Super Bowl party.

I'm bringing in my kids.

You want Kalani to go with me?

Yeah. He was like, yeah, da da da da da.

And he was like, oh, I'll think about it.

It sounds like, all right,
I'll call back in a couple hours,

call back and come out.

His client was like,
she decided not to go.

I wanted to say, girl, pick her up

simple downstairs and tell her, let's go.

She's going, she's going.
But I knew you were struggling.

I also knew you were struggling with that.

Like you were.

You would not have been able to relax
and peace the way you needed to, right?

If you would have made her go,
because you would have been worrying about

how she's acting,
which would have been impacting

you would have thought

she would have impacted my son
or the other kids when, yeah, I get it.

So that's the struggle, I think from my
perspective because I'm like, she will be.

Pack that girl up, send her downstairs
she’ll be fine.

You get some sleep, you get some rest,
do some make up, whatever you need to do.

The make up

for. sure

Right. But it is tough.

Yeah, it is tough. Yeah.

But I think that, like, anything,
finding the people who get you.

Right. Right.

Like, I feel like motherhood
and the journey of motherhood,

there's so many ways to mother
people have their things.

But I feel like finding your group
that you can identify with, right.

That can validate you.

I think that has been huge
because I feel like we often at times like

we can joke together in the same manner,
but I probably won't

and call another friend
and say that to, like girl

my daughter, I'm about to knuckle up
when somebody says, oh my God, no.

It's like you're. Never.

Like, oh.

Like, I know I'm not going to hit her
like, you know what I mean?

But just being able to like find

That person that.

I, that you just resonate with
and that I think that is really

what helped you do that
journey, the crazy ride of motherhood.

Right? Absolutely.

Because this is like I always tell people,

this is the hardest thing
I've ever had to do.

And you can't stop it.

It doesn't stop because we have
a lot of responsibility, right?

We could either do totally right

by our kids are totally wrong.

Either way, you.

Think you'd be doing the right thing,
but you're. Not.

Then they get older.
You're like, wait, what happened?

Because I thought I was me.
It really intentional.

You don't have any more control.

It's like,
oh wow, all of that is like on us, right?

And it's that every day
that thought process.

Yes. Here.

And I remember
talking to someone about it,

I think an older woman and she we were
talking about motherhood and everything,

and she said something that resonated
with me so much, and it was just like,

okay.

She said, you know how I know
you're a good mom?

Because of how the thought process of you

being a mom, so you're actively thinking

about how these things are going to affect
her, your decision making.

You care about the ending goal. Yeah.

And you mother, from that viewpoint.
Right.

And I was like, you're right.

Right. The validation. Yeah.

You know because like
first of all the fact

that you understand this,
I feel like I was alone in that.

Yeah.

Because I feel like a lot of people like
to act like they got it all figured out.

Yeah, yeah.

They cut their kids sandwiches and stars

and very, very smiley faces and stuff.

And to some people that's what

Motherhood means

And then I'm just like, all the. Energy
into that.

Yeah, yeah. And to some people,
that's how we weigh it. Right.

Like everybody has a different.

We talk about values and morals
and being ethical.

That's loving on people,
being good to people and teaching.

How am I cultivating you to be a human

that's going to be out here taking care of
folks who's going to love God?

Who's gonna make sure that you're so.

Do you remember what I always say
about my kids? Yes.

The at the end of the day,
you want to teach your kids

how to love people, how to love on people.

That is your biggest.

That's how you know
that you have been a good mom right now.

You're just teaching them
how to love people.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

How to love people
and be a good human being. Yeah.

That's the idea.

That career paths may be one thing,
they may be this.

But are you a good person?

How are you loving people?

How do you treat people?

How are you loving on your neighbors,
your family, each other?

How do you show up in this world?
Exactly, exactly.

I want my kids to be good human beings
when they leave my house.

Yeah, this is such a good conversation.

I feel like it was so needed.

I hope that this validated
a mother out there.

There's no perfect way to be a mom,
especially when you

I also when you. I don't want to say
especially.

And have multiple kids. Yeah.

They have the parent differently.
You have to love them differently.

And it's just like, wow.

And they don't understand that because
they're looking at how I deal with Max.

Max is looking at how I do a Madison
versus Marley,

and they don't understand that you three
are completely different.

And I have to pour into you differently.
I do

So it's hard.

It's hard.

But,
we do the best we can with what we have,

and I think we have to be, like we say,

all the time, we really intentional,
about breaking curses.

Yeah, well, curses get passed down
and down and down and down.

You look up and you realize,
oh, this is that.

It's like, yeah. It's like, oh that's me.

Right. And so what. Yeah.

What would be like your
like piece of advice that you would leave

to a mother who's watching this, who often
at times feels like how we're feeling.

Like maybe like I know

you had the podcast that you are doing
with your best friend called Bad Mom.

Yeah, yeah, we're.

Worst moms ever.

Yeah.
So what would be your piece of advice

for a mom who feels like the worst
mom ever?

Yeah. What would be like your takeaway?

My biggest piece of

advice is don't
forget to give yourself grace.

We give everybody else grace,
but we forget to give ourselves.

We forget to remind ourselves
that we're human.

We're not perfect.

I have to.

I really have to give myself
a lot of grace.

Yeah, and just say, Jamie,
you have feelings.

You're human.

You did the best you could
in this situation. Or

do things a little differently.

Next time, reflect. Right?

But definitely give yourself grace.

And I'm still yours and say,
find your person.

Find that one person

that you can call like, you know,
like my childhood best friend Chanel.

How you know, when me dealing with Madison and some of her things

that she has going on
and she just gets it. Yeah.

And there's no judgment that's.

Yeah, I can find that.

Find that mother and find that person
and just completely lock in.

Because there are days
you're going to call that person

and you want to say, I need to.

I want to box out so badly today.

And it just going to be like,
yeah, that was me yesterday, girl.

I get it.

Not, no that your child you just have.....
I know that.

A girl bring them kids over here.

Find you and find you.

Your person. Definitely. Yeah.

What about you?

For me, I would say find.

Find your person.

And also, too,
don't be afraid to step away in moments

where you don't have the answers
and moments where it's

feels like I find myself
sometimes just taking a break.

Or I tell my daughter

I might not have the answer for that right
now, but like, give me a moment

and just being okay
with not always knowing, right?

Like I don't try to like
just give her or like pretend

sometimes like mommy doesn't know right
now, but let me and I'll come back to you.

That's a good one. Yeah.

So. Yes.

But make sure that you guys go ahead
and get your downloadable

version of the podcast journal.

If you go on my Instagram,
it is right there in the bio.

It's a link right there
so you can purchase it.

It's really good, guys.

Yeah. And for right now it is $8.99.

But that's an exclusive price
because at some point it will not be $8.99.

The price is going up.

So thank you so much for being here
for another episode

of Thee Real Joy podcast,
and we'll see you again soon. Bye.